Stimulus & Response / “The Agenda”

This post is a response to reader “fishingrod”‘s recent comments:

fishingrod: Hi Bill,

I guess it is easier to keep in mind why guys do what they do when this whole “wanting to get laid” thing is part of your own agenda.

Hey Fishingrod. 😀

“Wanting to get laid” isn’t part of the agenda. Wanting to get laid is *THE* agenda.

Bill Cammack - Channeling What Women Want!Of course this isn’t true for all guys, and it’s not why ALL guys get into relationships.

My point in bringing this up over and over is that exactly what you’re saying is what keeps women from understanding what happened to them in a lot of situations. I don’t know *ANYBODY* that has ANY choice in the matter whatsoever who’s dating a chick that he doesn’t find physically attractive.

I don’t know ANYBODY that has deliberately kicked it to (introduced themselves to with the intent of beginning dating) a chick where he said “Damn… That chick is REALLY UNATTRACTIVE… I’ve GOT to meet her!”.

Granted, you have guys that don’t have any visual taste in women, so they end up dating chicks that *YOU* think are ugly, haha but that doesn’t mean that THEY aren’t attracted to her. Also, they might be attracted to her body and are letting her grill slide, because they like having sex with her. In that case, while they themselves would call their girlfriend “ugly”, they’re cool with that. Then you have the guys that got into a relationship and then their chick sat around with the remote control and the bon bons until she no longer looked the way she did when he was initially attracted to her. Now, these guys are looking for ways to avoid having sex with their ‘busted’ girlfriends.

Obviously, there are myriad permutations, however, it’s a high-percentage chance in the currently-active dating game that the basic, underlying reason that a guy is talking to a gal is because he’s physically attracted to her and wants to have some format of sex with her…. Actually, let me roll that back and just say generally that he finds something STIMULATING or AROUSING about her, which is his impetus for meeting her in the first place.

So let’s try to make it really simple. Stimulus & Response. Because women don’t “get” what men’s stimulus is, y’all misunderstand men’s responses. A guy asks you what time it is and you think he wants to know what time it is. A guy asks you to dance, and you think he just wants to dance with you. A guy asks you out and you think he just wants company for a meal. A guy sends you a bootie-call text at 3am and you think he’s lonely. A guy has sex with you and you think you’re on your way to a relationship with him. A guy tells you he hates you and you think he won’t have sex with you right after that. A guy has a girlfriend or wife and you think he’s not going to try to hook up with you. A guy hires you as a secretary, and you think it’s because you can type, when that out-of-shape, ugly chick types *TWICE* as fast as you do and you look good in a miniskirt.

So.. “Wanting to get laid”, or, to simplify, STIMULUS *IS* The Agenda.

For example, I like to eat a boiled egg in the morning. And I usually have it with toast and jam. My husband likes it with salt, and sometimes I remember to put the salt on the table, but more often than not I forget it because I don’t need salt on my egg.

ok.. Let’s roll with this…

breakfast[fishingrod] = boiled egg + toast + jam
breakfast[MRfishingrod] = boiled egg + salt

So this appears to be different, and on the surface, it is. You don’t bring the salt because it doesn’t occur to you. However, the rest of it DOES occur to you, because breakfast[either] = boiled egg. If you remove the difference in “dressing”, both of you enjoy a boiled egg in the morning, so you can relate to that. Chunking up further, eggs or no eggs, both of you are eating breakfast. Even further, both of you are EATING. So why do you bother eating? First of all, because you would DIE otherwise, but second of all, because you felt like eating, which is a RESPONSE to STIMULUS. You are potentially responding to HUNGER, because you just slept for several hours and haven’t eaten during that time. You are also potentially responding to routine or brainwashing which has made you the type of person to eat breakfast in the morning. Similarly, there are people who have been brainwashed to drink coffee in the morning and believe they can’t function without it. There are people who have been brainwashed to believe the need to smoke cigarettes to calm their nerves…

So toast & jam satisfies the craving that MRfishingrod gets and salt completes the craving that fishingrod gets while they are both accomplishing either “I ate breakfast this morning” or “I was hungry, so I ate”.

Women buy multiple pairs of shoes that look exactly the same for the exact same reaason. Stimulus and Response. Women see the shoes, like them, want to own them and break out the plastic. Women walk out of the store satisfied with their new shoes that they never saw before in life before they came across the shoe store window display while walking down the street.

[Many] Men get the exact same kick out of the sudden concept of having sex with a woman they’ve never seen before. This is why pornography and prostitution will *NEVAR* go out of style.. but that’s a different topic, entirely….

Same thing with getting laid. I realise that this is extremely important for guys, but I have no idea why. It is not important to me. I like sex, but sex as merely a physical pleasure has never interested me that much. If it is just that and nothing else, what do you need another person for?

There are guys that feel the same way. They’re completely disinterested in having sex. I understand that that’s not what you’re saying about yourself, 🙂 but I think it’s important to note.

NYC At Night by Bill Cammack“Getting Laid” is actually a complex issue…

There are guys that enjoy it for the physicality of it… the arousal, plateau, peak, release (APPR) of it. There are guys that enjoy the conquest of it (bagged another chick, another notch on the belt). There are guys that use getting laid as confirmation that “they’ve still got it” as far as pulling chicks.

There are guys that use it to boost their self-esteem. Guys that are addicted to the high of being “in the game”. Guys that don’t give a damn what women have to say and don’t see any value in them other than sexual value. Guys that are just plain turned on by attractive women and want to express themselves to them.

There are guys that are bored and can’t afford other formats of recreation, but can pull chicks for free. Guys that have sex with chicks just so they can tell interesting stories to their boys the next time they hang out. Guys that want to have kids that look better than they do so they attempt to impregnate attractive girls. Guys that are polyamorous and honestly don’t end one relationship with a chick before starting a new one with another one…

So, there’s really not ONE reason WHY getting laid is important to guys, because there are so many aspects to the situation that a guy might get something out of.

Basically, the reason this question is tough for me to answer is because it’s so… basic. 😀 It’s so ingrained. The reason why some people enjoy hooking up with people they’ve never seen before is the same reason why people do just about ANYTHING. Why do people play baseball? Why do people go fishing? Why do people get college degrees and then try to make money in the stock market? Why do people visit New York City or Paris? It’s an urge. It’s a desire. You feel it or you don’t.

If you’re the type of person that feels that urge, it’s obvious. It’s as clear as Hunger or Thirst or Cold or Anger or Fear. It’s practically tangible, and it makes all the difference in the world. The same way you know that you want to eat, someone else knows they want to have sex with this person they just saw right now for the first time in life. It’s primal. It’s instinct. I’m finding it extremely difficult to access the “Why?” behind such a core issue. You’re asking me to explain why people smile when they like something or laugh when they’re tickled. I can’t explain it, I just know it happens.

Having said that, I think it also comes down to one’s life experiences. I’ve had girls coming on to me since my first recorded memory. I’ve never had a reason to be in a relationship with a chick (though I HAVE been in relationships) in order for the two of us to enjoy ourselves the way we want to. Women being easily & quickly available has a pretty devastating psychological effect. How many boiled eggs are you committed to? That’s right. None. You have a different boiled egg every morning and you still experience “breakfast” with it. Capisce? 😉

I think it’s something you become accustomed to. If your life experience is that you only have sex with people you’re in a relationship with, I guess that’s going to influence your future decisions. If your life experience is that you only have sex with people you care about and who care about you, it might not make sense to you to mess around outside of those circumstances.

Meanwhile, if your life experience is that you have sex with people you’ve mainly never seen before and usually never see again after a period of a few months (or less), I would assume one becomes accustomed to the fact that there wasn’t any time to figure out whether these people liked you or not before you got down to the nitty-gritty. What they’re thinking becomes completely irrelevant and has nothing to do with your APPR pattern. The only thing left is whether you want them and they want you.

I’m not saying that this is a GOOD thing, but rather that thoughts like “Does she like me as a person?”, “Does she love me?”, etc never occur because they have no value other than as potential accelerants. When you live in an environment for long enough, certain things cease to matter and you probably don’t even realize that they’re gone. It’s kind of like how you send people to war and tell them to kill people and then when they survive their tour of duty, you tell them to NOT KILL PEOPLE when they come back home. The answer to the question “Does she love you?” is “Dunno. Doubt it. I’mma hit it though”. Peripheral issues like that aren’t even a fleeting consideration.

Sex as just a physical pleasure is no more exciting than a good meal.
And eating is something that I can do on my own, if you know what I’m saying…..

hahaha That’s exactly why a lot of chicks in this town substitute food for sex. 😀

As far as your question about “What do you need another person for?”, you’re absolutely right. This is why porno and prostitution will always be big business. Guys (& Gals) can hit their APPR cycle without involving anyone else at all.

All Well & GoodThat’s all well and good, assuming that the kick for the people in question is their own stimulation and completion as opposed to stimulating and completing someone else. Some people are doERS and some people are doEES. If you’re a doER, you might just need to have SOMEBODY to drive over the edge in order to feel like you’re having a good time.

That doesn’t mean you have to like them as a person or be in some sort of relationship to them. It just means that whomever you perceive them to be at this point in time, physically (or, in some cases, mentally) interacting with them floats your boat and drives you through your cycle. Also, as I listed above, depending on what a person’s REAL focus is for having sex in the first place, someone else might be necessary, regardless. To some people, this equates to ‘using people for sex’. To others, it’s life as usual.

So this is the reason that I sometimes forget why guys do what they do. That they pretend and lie and deceive and invent alter egos and what not just to get something that means so little to me. All the energy spent for just that?

And that, I believe, is a critical component to women getting consistently blindsided. Women think that if they don’t MAKE themselves attractive, they’re not attractive. They ask “Why did he kick it to me when I was wearing sweats… and my hair wasn’t done… and I wasn’t wearing my makeup?” It’s because HE wanted something from you in your current state. There was something attractive about you in his opinion, OR he’s just one of those guys that kicks it to any chick he sees. Women ask “Why did he press up on me? I didn’t give him an indication that I was physically interested in him!”. Nobody cares what you indicate. They care how THEY feel and what THEY want.

The ability to look across the chasm and imagine yourself as Goliath instead of David is entirely invaluable if your goal is to figure out what the other team is doing or thinking. The ability to cease projecting YOUR interests and values on someone else is what allows you to open your mind and potentially see reality instead of your own private version of what’s happening.

I’m sure you have MORE questions now than you had before you read this hahaha.. too bad, so sad. 🙂 The feeling “I want to have sex with this person” occurs to some people entirely independently of “I want to spend time with this person” or “I want to get to know this person”. It’s CERTAINLY completely independent of “I love this person” or “I’m in love with this person”. Another issue is whether some people ever feel sexual desire towards anyone AT ALL in their entire lives. Lots of people have sex that they’re not actually turned on by. They do it because other people like it or they think it’ll make other people like THEM or to try to save their relationship or for lots of other reasons having nothing to do with their personal APPR.

Ultiimately, this has been an excellent exercise, but it’s extremely difficult to explain an urge for desire fulfillment to people who aren’t familiar with how that particular urge feels. I think people’s upbringing and life experiences make them more sexually compatible with some people and less so with others. I can tell you this much.. If you ever DO experience that primal urge, then you’ll understand EXACTLY what I haven’t been able to tell you! 😉

~Bill

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15 Comments

  1. “…he finds something STIMULATING or AROUSING about her, which is his impetus for meeting her in the first place.”

    I’d also add that a guy can have a change of heart(?) about a woman he wasn’t initially attracted to (not to be confused with repulsed by). Like a female co-worker who the dude finds out one day has a great smile, thoughtful pose, voice that gives him goosebumps, walk, a million dollars, or some other transitory effect that he didn’t see earlier and all of a sudden, BANG, Pavlov rings the dinner bell in his subconscious and he’s over at the water cooler tellin’ Joe how miss “average” just does something for him! You’ll note the absence of a slow warmup. 😉

    However it happens it just happens and it’s fun and enervating! Explaining why doesn’t seem to lead to any greater understanding else why would women keep asking? By the way, I’ve had lots of married guys tell me how much they miss that feeling. They’re “suffering” from reduced levels of testosterone, as a direct result of pairing up so the “hit” isn’t the same. I think. Bill’s stated it arightly that it has nothing to do with what any stop/go sign a woman may think she’s throwing up, when that switch gets flipped watch out, sistah’! 😀

    Ahem, we all get that in can be annoying if it’s the wrong time, place, or woman, but lets not forget, and woe be unto any guy that does, that the only conscious control part of this is how much the dude’s going to show on the outside; how cool can he play his response, ya’ dig? 🙂

    1. Definitely true that some chicks “grow on you”, and their way of being can endear them to you in ways that their bodies couldn’t possibly have achieved naturally haha 😀

      One way or the other, guys are after girls for SOME REASON, and if there were NO REASON, he’d be chasing a different chick. Unfortunately, a lot of women feel like guys want to date them for “who they are”… They bring up this “me” character as in “he loves me for ‘me'”, hahaha Meanwhile, her “me” might be that junk in her trunk that he noticed the first time he met her and wanted to know “Do fries go with that shake?” 😀

  2. Thanks guys! Glad to know the “Agenda”. All about a piece of butt, huh? All about “de booty”. Glad that is cleared up.

    Very timely, since I have someone traveling to meet me. Flying in (wife left at home/visiting family and he doesn’t want to go with her and or girlfriend busy that weekend? memorial day weekend). Nowadays who knows for sure until he shows you what he is about.

    Not staying with me, has booked a local motel.

    Yes he has traveled to meet women before I asked. I have traveled to meet men before. However now I refuse to do so for anyone. Hence he is coming here.

    So he finds “something arousing and stimulating about her” so is it sex or Memorex, or the thrill of the chase? probably all.

    Seems nice although could be a sociopath, extreme OCD or some other mental disorder. On the other hand might be nice. Regardless my friends will be on alert and have my cell phone number and will have the plate number of this guy when he shows. I always request a drivers license to establish identity and home address. No show the address no date no matter how innovative the story. “I lost it, left at home ect…” any ideas guys?

    1. You mean I have competition?! lol Man, all this time I was just worried about Frank… 😀

      Seriously, you can’t find 10 guys within a hundred yards of where you’re standing right now who’d be interested in you? I don’t mean that to offend it’s just surprising.

      My advice: Dress like you know what fits and looks good on you and go out and have some fun. Oh yeah, throw some weird sh*t at him too not just that hopes and dreams crap. Like whatever it is that really makes you you. If you say something really crazy and he’s still all into you chances are he’s gunning for that ‘tay. So see if you can freak him out then report back in the next day. Oh, yeah. If h is freaked then he was prolly really trying to get to know ya’. You can make up that deficit on the second day unless he came out to see someone else. 🙂

      I’m only half serious, there just seems to be a lot of freight/expectations/anxiety in the way when people travel that far to meet someone. shrug

      1. <>

        Seriously, NO. I live in Cottonwood Arizona. White men here do not date black women and Black men here are few and far between. This is ARIZONA.

        1. She has a point, Steve. Depending on where you’re standing and what you look like, you might be completely SHORT when it comes to dating.

          It’s like how you can be as good an Asian actor as you wanna be, but you sill won’t be getting any roles on American television or in films… other than those specifically written as “The Asian In The Movie”.

          Thank God I never got stuck in the sticks, or I would have been married AGES AGO! 😀

    2. @Tina: See, but it’s NOT cleared up haha 😀 I’m beginning to believe that there’s some kind of survival mechanism built into women that disallows y’all from believing that a guy’s coming after you for “that thang”. It’s really kind of interesting how I keep telling chicks that’s what’s going on, they keep denying it and then a month later, it’s like “yeah, that’s what he wanted” hahaha

      I know you know that “Wife at home” isn’t a good jumping-off point for a relationship haha so hopefully your encounter will hit the spot without leaving you drooling for more of what you can’t get.

      Good luck with those security measures also. Play ON, Playette! 😉

  3. hmmmmmmmmmmm… I would say, that NEVER EVER EVER having locked eyes with anyone from across the room and said “wow what a beuatiful mouf’, she must be able to have a great convesration”. I probably fall into the “see a chick, meet a chick, try to bag chick and uhm oh her friend is hotter” category. I tend to raect to the “hunger” because eating? oh yeah that was 1,1a, 1b, 1c and nuber 2 on the agenda. I dont think i have a 3, gotta check. If I have to travel to get some, calling it an agenda is a waste of words. its almost a duty! (sorry ladies but the truth shall set us free). When woman accept this mosy of us will get married. the funny thing is that for all the finger pointing that women do, show me one who ran across a crowded street because that guy looked like he was well spoken. uhm, yeah… we are all trained to make the visual connection and our point of sexual interest-ONE AND THE SAME! difference is that guys are FLAGRANT about it. Again (and i have said this numerous times) I have never been the best looking or thinnest dude in a room BUT i have had some woman admit that he reason it was on and grinding was because “..you just looked like you had sex written all over you…” Of course to my detriment that aggresiveness has aslo held me back in some spots. So even when i succeded or failed, the woman had their own agenda-THEY JUST CHOOSE TO PRETEND! I think its interesting when woman say “all he had on his mind was getting some”, well we were at a bar full of singles. if i wanted tea and crumpets, I’d visit my mom! 🙂

    1. lol.. As usual.. TRU-DAT! 😀

      That’s one of the things.. Women don’t like to admit that they go after guys that they think are gonna wear that ish out. They go after technicians… The guys that look like they’re going to make it worth her while to get the program started.

      If they don’t know from seeing him, they know after he speaks or from the way he holds her or the way he looks her in her eye and tilts his head towards the bar bathroom with the lock on it.

      As oblivious as a lot of women are that a guy wants to kick it with them, there are quite a few that can feel it coming and make themselves available for the guy to do WHAT he likes for AS LONG as he likes 😉

  4. Hi Bill,

    thanks a lot for that detailed and interesting reply. Sorry for not de-lurking earlier, I was traveling and had no time to write.

    I will keep the concept of APPR and doer vs. doee in mind, found that very convincing.

    Regarding that primal urge thing that you mentioned, I believe it is the same difference as in planners vs. spontaneous people. I do experience strong urges, but mainly in a negative way. When someone suggests something, and I DON’T want it, the feeling of NOT wanting to do it is very intense, it hits me like a ton of bricks and I act upon it immediately. It is as if every cell in my body screams “nooooooo”, and I know in an instant what to do in order to not make the undesirable thing happen.

    But the positive urges are very weak, sometimes it takes me ages to find out what I want. I guess that people with positive urges are the ones that always expect good things to happen (like you) and are more likely to be spontaneous, while the ones with negative urges expect bad things to happen and are more likely to be planners….

    1. I don’t know how I missed this, haha.

      I actually find what you’re saying to be not only feasible but typical. It’s much easier to move a female negatively than it is to move her positively. For instance, I can tell a gal she looks good, and she’ll shy away from the statement or say something to the contrary or have a mild, subdued reaction to what I said.. kind of as if she doesn’t believe the compliment I’m giving her.

      Meanwhile, if I tell her she looks fat or out of shape, she gets all upset about it and FULLY believes what I said and will just about go berserk defending herself against accusations of looking poorly.. or, at least, vigorously telling me what her excuses are for her current state of disrepair.

      This is one of the reasons guys have to be so aggressive with chicks in the first place. It’s tough to gain ground on them and EASY to lose ground. You have to avoid the negative while finding the positive needles in the haystacks. This is why so many relationships are completely disingenuous, because the guy’s only telling the girl what he wants her to hear in order for her to feel like being who he wants her to be.

      So… If she’s out of shape, but you’re still willing to have sex with her, say she looks fine and you get what you want. You’re doing HER a disservice by not prompting her to get in the gym, but since your goal wasn’t her health, but rather your pleasure, everything’s everything. 😀

  5. Here we go with a followup: guy flew in on may 24 at 6pm, he was a dud, lied about height and pic on internet seemed as if it was 5-7 years ago. Dinner was good I picked the restaurant he got the tab , took him and dropped him back off at his hotel. (no I did not get out and go in). He brought pic albums of his family for me to see. No did not take him to my home.
    Picked him up next morning for breakfast and he was back to plane by way of a shuttle by 3pm of 25th headed back to Ca. oh my Goodness! lol

    that was a lot of moving and shaking going on by him
    I had a good dinner and breakfast. jeeze

    1. Interesting. Well, I’m glad nothing negative happened to you. Can’t say that sounds like “a good time”, haha. I discussed lying about height in It’s All In The Game (Online Dating). Nobody cares about telling you the truth, unless the truth’s going to get them laid faster.

      That’s an interesting tactic… Pictures of his family? He might have been better off bringing along the new Al B Sure album. :/

      Yes. For some odd reason… There’s a *NEW* Al B Sure album! hahahaha 😀

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