Dating vs. Hanging Out

The other night, I was trying to explain to a friend of mine that DatingGenius doesn’t “date”. I wasn’t satisfied with my attempt at making her understand what I meant so I’m going to try again right now. πŸ˜€

Dating vs. Hanging Out

The Kid doesn’t date. I hang out with women. The difference is that dating implies progression as opposed to spending time together on a particular day, night or evening. A date is merely a hangout with the added implication that you’re trying to screw her along with whatever else you had planned, like dinner, drinks, movies, museums, looking at antiques… (don’t ask! :D)

My friend Joyce told me I’m “Always On”. I think that’s an accurate statement. Joyce would know first-hand and anybody that’s seen The Kid in action around a chick I’m into will attest to the fact that I have *no* need to create some special circumstance to kick game to a chick and try to get on. If I’m motivated and the gal turns me on, I instinctively know what to do and it usually happens right there on the spot. If I’m not turned on, nothing happens at all. This would be the case whether I was on a “date” or a hangout so there’s no need to make a distinction.

Dating’s a holdover from back in the day when I was brainwashed about the process by which you become intimate with women. You see one you like, you meet her, you get her number, you call her to smalltalk, you eventually ask her out on a date. The reason you have to ask her out is because you set yourself up from day 01 as someone attempting to woo her or become a suitor. The whole process you were going through with her was setting the scene for popping the question. You were finding out about her while she was finding out about you so y’all could make an educated decision about whether you wanted to meet up and do something.

BFF > Temporary Boyfriend

I realized that this was the wrong way to go, hilariously enough, by LOSING raps. I would like some chick and friends of mine would like her also. Next thing you know, it’s off to the races with all of us trying to get her. At some point (which was usually that very same day, so we had to work fast against each other), she’d have to choose one of us. I remember losing a rap to this HAWT chick that I was DYING to hook up with! πŸ˜€ I mean DY-YING! πŸ˜€ I was totally kicking myself that I lost that one! πŸ˜€

What happens in that case is that I automatically dive-bomb into friends mode with her. It’s part of “the game”. Regardless of what YOU really want to do, you respect the fact that the chick chose your friend just the same way that you want him to respect the fact that some chick chose you and he had to sit that one out. Some guys take it so far as to completely ignore a chick that chooses a homeboy of theirs so there’s no chance for accidental impropriety. I used to do that, but after being confronted about it a couple of times by the chicks I was ignoring, I decided to go the speak to, but “just friends” route. Of course, once the relationship was over between her and my friend (which it always was, eventually), if we were still into each other, it was ON!

Anyway, the funny thing that I learned from losing raps was that the only thing I was losing was not having sex with this particular chick because my friend had already laid claim to her. Meanwhile, I gained a new Excellent Friend and a powerful ally. First of all, we were friends because she knew I was into her and thought she was cute, sensual, sexy or whatever I told her before I *LOST* the rap! πŸ˜€ Second, we were friends because she knew that I was close to “her boyfriend” and that words from me in one direction or another could make her relationship better, worse or nonexistent. Third, sexual tension from her side of things was relieved (while mine was probably quintupled :/) because I became, to her, something similar to a brother-in-law. She was family to me because she was dating my family so she knew I was in her corner and looking out for her by extension.

Fourth, and possibly the most lucrative aspect of becoming friends with a chick I actually WANTED, I became the de facto guy to be hooked up with ANY and ALL of her single girlfriends. I think this was the craziest thing of all now that I’m thinking about it. My friend who got the rap to her was now being hawked night and day to see if he was kicking it with ANY other chicks. Meanwhile, his girlfriend is introducing me to all of her girlfriends, roommates, schoolmates, relatives, random girls we meet in the street or at bars… Dudes… Trust me… If you want to meet a bunch of girls IMMEDIATELY when you go to a bar, take a gregarious, attractive female with you that’s interested in hooking you up. It’s completely unfair! πŸ˜€

5th, The intimacy between us would develop into trust, where I would always end up having a way more REAL relationship to her than she was having to my friend that she was dating. The fact that they could tell me stuff that wouldn’t get leaked to their boyfriends even though I was clearly tighter with him than I was with her made them interact with me more openly and honestly, which a) I really cherished and b) made OUR relationship last way longer than their relationship to the friends of mine they had been dating at the time.

The Dating Trap

Another problem with “dating” is that you can’t go backwards from it without the chick feeling sour. It’s a trap. If you ask her out on a date and then the next time you invite her to a party as part of a group or something, she’s going to wonder what happened or if you don’t like her anymore or whatever. Meanwhile, if you hang out with a chick and you just so happen to make out with her before dropping her off at her house, she can’t feel anything but good about that. She knows you’re into her, everybody had a good time that evening and there’s no pressure between you to do it again next time or NOT to do it again next time.

You also run into stupid questions like “where is this relationship going?”. It’s really not in your best interests to frame a hangout as a “date”. Well… The *ONLY* reason it would be worthwhile to frame it as a date is if she wouldn’t hang out with you UNLESS it was a date. If that’s the case, then it’s worth it to ask her out just so you can get your hands on her and see what you can do. However.. At this point in time, I’m not sure that I’d ever date a chick that wouldn’t spend time with me at all unless there was something else in it for her other than spending time with me.

Also, going on the actual date after asking a girl out is anticlimactic. You know what’s important to find out before you go on the actual date. If she declines, you know you have way more groundwork to put in if you’re gonna get on with this chick. If she accepts, you know she’s willing to give you a shot at being a suitor. There’s no reason for her to “date” you unless she’s thinking about being your girlfriend somewhere down the line. Similarly, there’s no reason for YOU to frame it as a date unless you’re having her audition for the girlfriend role.

Spending Time is Spending Time. You’re gonna make your moves whether it’s a date or a hangout. She’s going to go for it or not depending on how she feels about you. You’re not gaining anything by labeling a hangout a “date”. Also, how would you know if you want a chick to be your girlfriend BEFORE you spend time with her? πŸ˜€ That’s like guys getting married to chicks before they tap it, but that’s an entirely different discussion.

Having said that… πŸ˜€

There IS another reason that you might want to tell a chick you want to take her out on a date. It’s lame, but it’s actually true, now that I’m thinking about it…

Business Is Business

If you DON’T tell her that you’re going out on a date with her, she might not put her best foot forward, visually. I hate it when that happens, advise against it and usually stop hanging out with chicks that insist on showing up for hangouts looking like bums. The wisdom is this… FIrst of all, have some respect for MY entertainment like I have respect for YOUR entertainment. The Kid doesn’t just jump up out of bed and rush out to the bar to hang out with my homegirls. I want to be presentable because a) it adds to her enjoyment of the evening, b) we’re in public, so she doesn’t have to feel embarrassed about sitting around talking to a bum, and c) I have no idea what other chicks are going to show up that I might feel like kicking it to, so it’s in MY OWN best interest to go outside ready to rawk.

All three of those apply to chicks you hang out with as well. They SHOULD dress well and look good when they come to hang out with you a) for YOUR personal enjoyment, b) so that when other guys in the bar that they might like see them, they give the gals credit for their style, and c) that the gals feel confident about their looks and presentation so that IF they get that rap that they weren’t expecting, they don’t have to run and hide and shy away from the dudes because they’re underdressed or whatever.

I like to explain this to chicks because if they want to dress like they’re in their living room, they should STAY in their living room. I’ve introduced LOTS of girls to guys, whether they were visually prepared for it or not. I’ll admit that I get BIG LAUGHS when chicks get caught out there and feel embarrassed for coming outside bummy and I make sure to tell them “I told you so” and that that’s good for them for being like “oh.. I’m only going to hang out with Bill.. No need for me to look good”. HAHAHA good for you! That’s what you GET! πŸ˜€

Anyway, that’s the other reason you might want to frame a hangout as a date. If she won’t put her best visual foot forward otherwise, you won’t be as inclined to kick it to her and the whole “date” spirals downhill. If that’s what it takes to motivate her to motivate you, make it happen. πŸ™‚

So.. No.. I don’t date. It’s a waste of time. It’s an implication of a nonexistent progression. I’m not looking to retire. I’m looking to have a good time. I’m looking to give what I’m inspired by her to give and receive what she feels inspired to give me. Period. Nothing More, Nothing Less. Meanwhile, I make moves in a box, I make moves near a fox, I make moves with Green Eggs & Ham. You can’t stop the bum rush. I do what I do, she goes for what she goes for and I have ZERO interest in telegraphing my moves by sending a chick an engraved invitation to go out on a “date” with me.

~ Bill Cammack | @BillCammack

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  1. “Third, sexual tension from her side of things was relieved (while mine was probably quintupled :/)”

    Hi Bill,

    just out of curiosity: Was it fun to be with that girl when you were in the state of mind you described in the quote, or was it more like a mild form of torture? Were you able to enjoy it? If so, how?

    1. You know?.. It’s funny that you bring that up. I’ve never thought about that to any deep level. Excellent question, as usual. πŸ˜€

      It was a very weird, strange kind of fun. It was great because I was firing on all cylinders at all times that I was hanging out with her. I would liken it to being in suspended animation, where I could see her, feel her, smell her, listen to her, experience her, but never pull the trigger.

      The reason it wasn’t torture is that I understood WHY I wasn’t pulling the trigger. It was the code. It had nothing to do with her and everything to do with my homeboy who actually got the rap. It’s a gentleman’s deal. First one in, everyone else backs off. Of course, all bets are off when their relationship’s over and your friend relinquishes his “ownership” of her. Until that time, it’s like being a Musketeer or a Knight of the Round Table. You have your job to do, which is to NOT kick it to this chick you’re dying to screw. There’s nobility in carrying out your task which far outweighs what you’d really love to do right now.

      I’ve been in some extremely compromising positions with friends’ girls and I’m glad to be able to say that I’ve never failed under those circumstances. πŸ™‚ Having said that.. There WAS a time when a friend of mine was dating a girl and I knew that relationship wasn’t going to last AT ALL because I knew both of their personalities very well. He’s a nice guy and she’s a scoundrel like me.

      I was coaching him as far as how he could relate to his girlfriend better and he vehemently rebuffed my advice. He REFUSED to do what I told him to do, which is the only thing I knew he could to do hold on to his girl because she was getting closer to me every week. Naturally, eventually, they broke up and he removed himself from the picture. There was unnecessary tension between us when I informed him how close his recent-ex was to me, but that was the chance I was willing to take to test out “The Code”. The Code doesn’t make any sense when you know a couple’s going to break up, and soon. It only makes sense when you want to go to extreme lengths to avoid ANY potential impropriety between you and a friend’s girl or when you know you’re better than him and you don’t want to diminish his girlfriend’s interest in him by showing her a good time and expressing your interests, feelings and personality to her.

      Even in that case, I still didn’t fail because I didn’t do anything with her while she was still with my friend. I can SAY that I failed because I abandoned the Prime Directive of ignoring her completely in order to avoid her developing feelings and physical interest in me.

      So.. Getting back to your question.. There’s way more valor in following the Prime Directive than hooking up with some chick that you want that your boy happened to get on with before you did and is currently dating. This is especially true because it’s too easy to bag girls that open up to you because they feel “safe” with you as far as you trying to get on because they know how important your friendship to your homeboy is. Shooting fish in a barrel.

      On top of that, chicks come and go every week but your homeboys are always around. I wouldn’t possibly be able to mentally recall 1/50 of the chicks that friends of mine introduced to me as someone they’re dating or as a girlfriend or whatever and eventually those gals were gone in the wind. I’m not even talking about chicks that my friends hooked up with without any form of dating or LTR at all. So, no.. It wasn’t any problem for me to keep my hands off of this one chick that I knew was going to disappear relatively soon while my friendship with my homeboy remained ad infinitum.

      It was a fun test of allegiance vs free will. I could have easily bagged her and alienated my boy, but for what? To what end or benefit? None. I knew I wasn’t going to keep her either. It was just something to do at the time. The only TORTURE in those situations is when your boy fumbles and you’re like “Man! I would have done so much MORE with this chick!”. If a guy’s going to beat your rap to a chick, you want to see him RAWK the relationship 100%, or at least do more with her than you figured you’d do, so you can feel happy that he bagged her instead of you.

      And yes, I knew exactly how much my friends were or were not RAWKING their relationships, because I was hearing about it from both sides. That was also kind of a fun/torture situation, hanging out with a chick and I know exactly how she gave it up last night, where, when and which item of furniture she had been bent over, while I’m playing it off like my boy never told me a thing. πŸ˜€

      1. I think every guy has been in this situation and many of them fail to uphold the code most of the time. When a guy doesn’t pull the trigger on a girl your messing with even though she is sweating you me personally i feel that regardless of how far south their relationship is going you still respect your homeboys boundaries and its hands off until he is clear. OTOH there are some benefits like that chick probably has other good looking friends and also when other random girls see this girl seating you all of a sudden they are sweating you to.

        1. Yeah, I had to test the code because I received it back in either HS or JHS and never actually made up my own mind about it. I was just following the rules.

          What I learned for myself was that my own Free Will overrides the code, except my desire is for my friends to have relationships that they like. I ended up creating my own code, which wasn’t one beholding to other dudes, but being true to what I wanted which was to be a friend to my friends and facilitate their happiness.

      2. “That was also kind of a fun/torture situation, hanging out with a chick and I know exactly how she gave it up last night, where, when and which item of furniture she had been bent over, while IÒ€ℒm playing it off like my boy never told me a thing.”

        I think in another post you wrote that this kind of talk between guys stops when a girl is upgraded from “date” to being “the one”. According to this logic, the fact that he told you about “how she gave it up” means that your homeboy wanted to screw her, YOU wanted to screw her, but nobody in that scenario really wanted HER. Poor girl.

        I can understand your explanation why being with her wasn’t torture. You thought you COULD have her (and I assume that your 725 female Facebook friends will agree that you were not deluding yourself), and were just holding back for noble reasons. You perceived yourself as active and powerful. I can imagine that this must feel good on some level, even when you “never pull the trigger”.

        Wen a guy I like chooses to be with someone else, I always avoid him like the plague because I perceive myself as passive and powerless in that situation, and that does not feel good on any level. He does not like me, and there is nothing I can do about it. (Well, I guess there is a fair chance I could persuade him to have sex with me, but since that is not the main thing I am after, why bother?)

        I am beginning to understand why people’s reaction to the same kind of situation can be so very different. Thanks, Bill. πŸ™‚

        1. As far as the “wanting” part, let me explain how that goes. πŸ™‚

          The reason guys kick it to girls is that we want to screw them. Period.

          If the chick chooses one of us over another one of us, she becomes off-limits to the rest of us by gentleman’s or sportsman’s agreement. Of course that doesn’t mean that the amount of lust that we felt towards this chick disappears from one day to the next or one MINUTE to the next when we find out she’s decided to hook up with our homeboy. It just goes in the non-action file.

          If they ever break up, she reverts to “fair game”. The exception to this is if she was with our friend so long that he developed deep feelings for her. In that case, out of respect for your boy’s feelings, the chick’s off limits for the rest of your ******* life.

          The phase you’re describing as “nobody in that scenario really wanted HER” isn’t accurate. EVERYBODY in the scenario wanted HER. ONE of us GOT her. That makes her his “property” as far as the fellaz are concerned, but that doesn’t give her any kind of status that you would define as “the one”. I’m talking about chicks that we met THAT NIGHT or at least very recently. All any of us know about the chick is that she turns us on. We don’t know what her personality’s like except for what we briefly encountered during our attempts to pull her.

          It could easily take months for a guy to feel like the chick that he’s hanging out with and having sex with goes into the “no information” zone. Until then, she’s the same as any other chick, except she’s a recurring character instead of a guest star on a single or a couple of episodes.

          Also, I should state that this isn’t for guys in general. This is for CLOSE homeboys that commiserate together about how to kick it with chicks and what works and what doesn’t. It’s important that we share the information so we don’t have to reinvent the wheel. I left a comment around here somewhere the other day about how when I was in college, this chick had told me she wasn’t going to have sex with me so I hopped up off her, screamed on her about how she was full of **** and hopped on the bus to go see another chick that I was supposed to see the next day but her appointment got pushed up because this chick fronted. As soon as I got back to school the next afternoon or evening, my boys heard all about the situation. First of all, it was current events. Second of all, it was important to let them know how chicks act so they could add that to their database and look out for it. Third of all, it was important for them to know that that one particular chick likes to front at the last second. πŸ™‚ Fourth, it was important for them to understand that they need to stack chicks up so they have a plan B and or C to go to if their plan A becomes a great big nothing for the evening.

          So, no. I wouldn’t agree that nobody wanted her. She just wasn’t to that crossover point between pulling her and seeing her as a chick he was WITH vs a chick he was MESSING WITH.

          hehehe I always have a problem with women making statements like “you THOUGHT you could have her”, because it’s an impossible situation to prove. Had I proven it, I would have failed and violated the Prime Directive. The fact of the matter is that all the indications were there that if I had turned the engine on, I could have bagged her. I have NO doubt about that, but at the same time, I can’t claim absolute knowledge, because I didn’t actually DO it. πŸ™‚

          See, one of the problems is that when a chick decides she’s dating some guy, a friend of yours or not, she fronts on her own physical attraction to you. That doesn’t mean it’s not there.. She just doesn’t act on it because she wants to feel faithful to “her boyfriend”. I get that. That’s the way the game goes. πŸ™‚ In the scenario I’m describing here, I was slow to kick it. It’s like when you’re playing pool and you let the other person break (shoot first) and they make all the shots they need and you never get to shoot. She never got the chance for me to kick it to her because by the time I met her, my boy already had his foot in the door which is enough for me to back off. It’s not like both of us rapped to her and were like “You should be with me” and she chose him over me. If that had been the case, I wouldn’t have claimed that I could have gotten on.

          The problem is that when you’re in that position with a chick, she opens up to you way more authentically due to the “no sexual threat” feeling I described earlier. As close as we were as (mandatory) friends, I know damned well that I could have pressed up on her at any moment and bagged her. On top of that, my boy eventually fumbled and I became better friends with her than he was with her. Easy bag once again. The problem was that the breakup was SO BAD that my boy would have felt poorly if I had kicked it to her so even though she was still FOYINE at the time, I had to let the situation go. But, Yes.. I could have bagged that at any time. πŸ˜€

          As far as it feeling good, it DOES feel good that you can sacrifice something that you want for the good of a friend. The alternative is being unreliable and untrustworthy, which isn’t a good look when you check yourself out in the mirror. πŸ˜€

          Having read more of your statement, this goes back to your “Optimist” statement. I see what you’re saying. Yes. I’m always powerful and proactive in my interactions with females. If nothing’s going on between us, it’s because I’m not personally pressing the issue for whatever reasons I have. Her three options are to get with the program as I’m laying it out to her, veto my moves or elect not to hang out with me anymore. If I’m still attracted to her, I’m coming after her, every day, all day. Nothing else in life makes sense.

          If I’ve pressed up on her and she vetoes the moves, I have the choices of keeping trying, accepting the veto and still hanging out with her or stopping hanging out with her entirely. I never have the feeling you describe, “She doesn’t like me and there’s nothing I can do about it”. The reason I would physically avoid a chick is that I know that when I get around her my system’s going to turn on and dictate to me what I should do with her and I don’t want to go into autopilot because I know she doesn’t want that so I would avoid her so I don’t naturally make her uncomfortable.

          People’s reactions are so very different because people’s goals are different and their “ends” are different. For some guys, a good night is only characterized by going all the way with a chick. For other guys, having a great evening with her, making out with her and putting her in a cab home is a good night. For other guys, none of that matters.. It’s only a good time if they meet a gal that they could see getting into a LTR and starting a family with.

          In the end, it’s pretty much a shot in the dark and people find out if they share the same interests & desires DURING the time they’re “going out” with each other and not BEFORE they declare that they’re dating someone.

          1. Wow, that was a long reply!
            So, if I happened to date one of your close friends, by the time I eventually make it to the “no information zone”, every guy in your inner circle would already know IN DETAIL how many times and in what fashion I gave it up to him? Well, right now I am really grateful for the ocean that is between my hometown and NY. πŸ˜‰

            “The exception to this is if she was with our friend so long that he developed deep feelings for her.”

            In my life, development of deep feelings comes first, and sexual attraction follows, so I keep forgetting that it is the other way round for most people you know. Sorry, my bad.

            Regarding the “EVERYBODY in that scenario wanted her” statement: I see your point. But the kind of want you are referring to does not mean that much, I think. See this:

            Maybe this is the reason why women who sleep around are called sluts and men aren`t. For a woman, it is no big achievement to get a man to sleep with her. It might mean she is attractive, but not necessarily so.

            From a geek chick’s perspective, this kind of male attention is not very exciting. So some guy thinks I am hot? The next minute, he turns around, sees a different girl and thinks she is hot, too. And then he sees another one…It is flattering, sure, a nice compliment. But not more. Nice to notice, but not meaningful enough to act on it.

            1. Your initial statement is accurate. You have to think about it like a sport. When the Yankees play, the fellaz want to know how many hits he got and whether the Yankees won the game. If a dude’s dating a new chick, the fellaz want to know how he’s doing with that. Even if they’re not getting blow by blow (hahahaha) details, they know damned well whether you’re giving it up or not. Meanwhile, it’s their job to play it off like they don’t know, so as not to sink their boy’s battleship.

              Yes, your style of interaction is inverted from what I’m talking about. I’d wager that most women “work” that way, feelings first, sex second. This is why R&B music is used against y’all to accelerate the process. You listen to what the singer’s bitchin’ and moanin’ about in his song about how he loves some chick and would do anything for her and you misplace those sentiments onto the guy that’s in your face tryin’na get laid and then you feel like “making love” to him while he’s ******* you. It’s all in the game. We already know how y’all operate and have developed extremely effective countermeasures. πŸ™‚

              Look at Tiger Woods. According to reports, he’s trying to make an agreement to shell out $80,000,000.00 USD to his wife to stay with him for seven years. This is probably because he didn’t have a prenuptial agreement and his wife could skate with many multiples of that amount if she divorced him. He already has 80 mil to waste. He’s going to make 80 mil back during that seven years anyway. That amount of money is a drop in the bucket to him. It’s all in the game. He doesn’t HAVE to buy off his wife. Tiger could get a new chick TO-DAY. Right this very minute! πŸ˜€ He’s decided he wants to keep this one, so now he has to do what he has to do to appease her. Effective Countermeasures.

              But yeah, the way it works is LUST first, LOVE second, if at all. If you have to Fake It ‘Till You Make It, so be it. Feign love, she falls for the okey-doke, game on.

              I agree that guys aren’t very choosey when it comes to one night stands, but that’s not what I’m talking about here. πŸ™‚ I’m talking about a chick that you intend to spend a lot of time with and screw LOTS of times. I’m not talking about hit it & quit it. I understand why women have a hard time wrapping their minds around the concept of sex without love or any other feelings other than wanting to have a good time and show the chick a good time also. I understand the concept of women only starting to feel sexually attracted to a guy that they already feel like they love. The problem is that women project that process onto men. There are lots of guys that love their women but won’t have sex with them because they’re not sexually attracted to her in her present state. There are lots of guys that don’t love their girlfriends but have sex with them all the time because they’re turned on by their chicks.

              Look at Jennifer Anniston. How did she get dumped by Brad Pitt? Because Brad felt like ******* Angelina Jolie. That’s It. Game Over! Thanks for playing! πŸ˜€ It’s not going to be easy for women who are sexually motivated by feelings of love to understand what’s really going on in life, but I keep tryin’na tell y’all! πŸ˜€

              To hear you tell it, Brad Pitt “fell in love” with Angelina Jolie while he was with Jennifer Anniston, right? πŸ˜€ hahaha He followed his heart, right? πŸ˜€ HAHAHAHAHA oh man. πŸ˜€ smh

              The reason why women who ‘sleep around’ are called sluts is that in a patriarchal society, y’all have to be shamed into NOT spreading your legs so there’s a higher percentage chance that when you get pregnant, it’s your husband’s kid. You always know who the MOTHER of a kid is. You can’t be sure who the FATHER is until you test it. If women were allowed to have sex any time they felt like it, all Hell would break loose! πŸ˜€ The chick that supposedly screwed Tiger ALSO screwed Jeter & A-Rod. Imagine that chick multiplied throughout the American female population! :O Everybody and his brother would be getting some and NOBODY would get married ever again! πŸ˜€ … Chaos! πŸ˜€

              Meanwhile, guys can’t possibly give a damn about being called sluts by women because we’re SUPPOSED to bag a lot of chicks. Biologically, we’re not SUPPOSED to put all our eggs in one basket because we’re duplicating mixing genes with the same chick. By impregnating multiple chicks, there’s more variance, which means it’s more likely that some of our kids are going to be viable in the next generation instead of all of them having the exact same defect because we had all of our kids with one gal. Y’all have a finite number of eggs. We have infinite sperm and make more every day. We’re not playing the same game. πŸ™‚

              No, it’s no achievement at all for a gal to get a guy to hit it. All she has to do is announce that she’s down for it and SOMEBODY’S gonna be desperate enough to hit it, regardless of how busted she is. As some guys will GLADLY tell you, ***** is *****.

              Your last statement is absolutely true as well. This is why we fake it as if we’re only interested in that one girl… to ALL of the girls we’re interested in. Effective Countermeasures. The game hasn’t changed since it began.

              Another thing that women have incredible difficulty doing is separating locker-room talk from actual technique. Women like to read my blog and then fantasize that I would tell stuff like this to a chick I was trying to bag. πŸ™‚ This is all inside information that I’m trying to share with y’all so the next time y’all get caught slippin’, you can say “Hmm… That’s EXACTLY what The Kid said!”. Next time, maybe you’ll be able to see how you telegraphed your moves and dude faked you out and skated with what he wanted from you.

              The cheating statistics have been hovering around 50% for as long as I can remember, yet everyone wants to run around acting like nobody does it. SOMEBODY’S doin’ it! πŸ˜€ Some of YOUR friends or family members are in that 50%. Somebody that YOU KNOW is doing what they WANT to do instead of what they’re “SUPPOSED” to do. I already know all this stuff before I write it down. I’m not sharing it with ME. I’m sharing it with YOU.

              I’ll tell you what, though.. I’ve gotten enough correspondence from women that have seen the light and had breakthroughs as far as how they deal with relationships that I’m satisfied already, even if NOBODY ELSE gets anything out of this blog ever again. πŸ™‚

              All I know is that I don’t think I’ve gone a single day without someone hitting my article “How To Break Up With Your Girl”, and certainly not “How To Avoid Pregnancy”, so y’all chicks need to keep your eyes open and pay attention to the game before some ill ish happens to YOU! πŸ˜€

              … And That’s The Bottom Line… ‘Cause Stone Cold SAID SO! πŸ˜€

              1. “We have infinite sperm and make more every day. WeÒ€ℒre not playing the same game. :)”

                Well, as a recent study shows….


                … the game you play might be different, but not as different as you all like to think. πŸ™‚

                I certainly appreciate your advice, Bill. For most of my life, none of the things you describe happened to me. It was pretty much black and white: Guys were either not interested in me at all, or they wanted a LTR. (Or maybe there were some who tried to “bag me”, but if that was the case, I was totally oblivious to their advances.) So I never had to rack my brain trying to figure out what a guy’s intentions were. But since I am always interested in exploring other people’s frame of mind, reading your blog has a very high entertainment value. It is almost like studying an alien species. πŸ˜‰

                By the way, in another post or comment, you wrote something about 2 girls you love, but that they don’t take your “I love you” statements seriously since you only say it when you are drunk. Can you tell me where you wrote that? I wanted to comment, but can’t find it anymore.

                1. lolol πŸ™‚ Irrelevant article. Kids are mostly mistakes.

                  That’s what condoms are for, so we can feign procreation without having it actually happen.

                  Guys who are TRYING to have kids should approach the game entirely differently. They should interview every girl they can get their hands on EVERY DAY to find one that really wants to troop it with him and start a family. Get her, Lock her down, Retire.

                  I see why you feel that way about the guys that approached you. I’m sure part of it was that you were oblivious, since women tend to project their lack of sexual interest before feeling “in love” onto guys and they think we work the same way. However, I’m also sure that once a guy talked to you and found out what you were into, he figured you were “too tough of a nut to crack” and bailed if he wasn’t interested in going the LTR route or at least faking it until you gave it up! πŸ˜€

            2. Fishingrod,
              “…every guy in your inner circle would already know IN DETAIL… Well, right now I am really grateful for the ocean that is between my hometown and NY” – If you are having sex with a man who has other male friends assume the buddies he’s close with know the details. They might not be getting a blow-by-blow but they at least know how it led up to the act(s). They will know because,
              A.) He’s very pleased with himself, and
              B.) He would like to educate them about how awesome he was last night
              C.) He would like them to write sagas about his prowess,
              D.)see A, B, C. lol

              Yes, men are roosters and we need to crow about it… unless it’s unexceptional and even then… Anyway, It’s an ego thang. I can’t imagine a scenario where a buddy would slip up and mention something he shouldn’t “know”. Mostly only the lessons learned will be retained and the rest really doesn’t matter. Nobody’s going to be slavering after you because you do X, Y, and Z. Shrug. Your buddy had a good time and wanted to share the details? Awesome, high fives all around and back to business. πŸ™‚

              1. In my case, it’s actually more than that. We always approached chicks as a sport. If you were playing baseball, you’d say “That pitcher always nods to the left before throwing a fastball down the middle” so your boy has a better chance of knocking one out of the park when it’s his turn.

                That’s where the think tank comes from. You put enough similar experiences together and you can figure out the pattern. The pattern works generally on women and then you have to make slight adjustments based on her personality. This is how education’s accelerated.

                The way to deal with someone like our friend Fishingrod is to either put the physical moves on her until she changes her mind about having to be in love before having sex OR making her believe that you’re in love with her, setting her up to fall in love with you and give it up to you for her own reasons. It’s elementary. A cakewalk. The only issue is the time and energy it would take to make that happen. Basic pattern, tweaked for personality.

                Same thing for chicks from different religions, lesbians, whatever. Doesn’t matter. They’re still women. There are always moves that can be made. If I don’t report back to the fellaz, they don’t learn, in which case they get stuck on unnecessary obstacles and they fail to have experiences with chicks that they can report back to me for MY education. Everyone contributes…….

                I mean… BACK IN THE DAY!!! πŸ˜€

                1. Bill is absolutely right dudes care way more about how you got to the point of having sex with a chick what happens after that is entertaining but we forget it like 10 min after hearing it. but everything that came before is very important it’s the same reason that quarterbacks watch film the whole week before they play, humans are creatures of habit as much as we like to think that we are unique individuals we all follow certain patterns which are influenced by the people around us and other environmental factors. Females do it to and they go into much more details than guys do, but they will never admit it.

                2. You know?… I hadn’t thought about it before, but this is absolutely true.

                  Nobody cares about what a guy does with a chick he already has in Deep Check. If he’s already married to her or they’ve been together for a while, it’s like *yawn*.

                  As a matter of fact, if a guy started a story with “Hey man… I took my wife skiing and…”, I’d have to stop him and change the subject, haha nobody cares after you already have it. We just care HOW. YOU. GOT. IT! πŸ˜€

  2. You’ve done a really bang up job at showcasing your views on dating vs. hanging out (this is your site after all..) but I sense in you a fear of confrontation with women. You see, I extract from the later parts of Neil Strauss’s game. Not being afraid of commitment and embracing the fact that you might find something REALLY intense and beautiful once you’ve gotten the girl.

    I find that once you date a woman, you start getting all these wonderful signs of her deep rooted affection; she’ll wash your clothes, cover your meals, your dishes, her orgasms are way more intense, and more frequent etc…those are but the surface though. You see truly how far she’ll go for you. I feel I know what actual seduction looks like…where NOTHING I do is wrong in her eyes. She’ll follow everything I do. Dating to me is fun, and when it becomes something that is no longer enjoyable..I have had no problems ending it for good.

    I guess this really does show how dynamic the game is..some of us get it into for the ability to have to never settle down, some use it to settle, and other use it just for the social interaction. I think I fall into the third category, I don’t really care about commitment itself or hanging out..I’m just a curious person by nature and I am always interested in seeing what’s inside us as people–on a deeper, personal level. Especially women.

    1. “…she’ll wash your clothes, cover your meals, your dishes […] You see truly how far she’ll go for you. […] like…where NOTHING I do is wrong in her eyes. She’ll follow everything I do.”

      The English language does not have enough words to describe how much the level of self-absorption in this statement disgusts me.

  3. I find it even more funny that one can be so naive as to think they themselves aren’t self absorbed. We are ALL self absorbed..the fact that anyone would have their own website is self absorbed. The want (or need) to have sex or get into PUA or the like is self absorbed. The day to day things you do in general are self absorbed–Because NO human can do things in a purely altruistic fashion. You seek personal gain in one way or another. Be it the emotional satisfaction for doing good for others, or monetary gain or a plethora of other examples. Nobody is that detached to be able to be NOT self-absorbed. The degree is variable.

    Ignorance is not bliss.

    1. Agreed that everyone is self-absorbed to a degree, Mick.

      Interestingly enough, if one is humble about their self-absorption, most people will let them slide… Saying “I’m self-absorbed and like it that way” is what draws attention.

  4. Yet, those words never came out of my mouth. The opinion expressed from “fishingrod” is purely driven by his own perception of what self-absorption is and his/her conditioning. I merely exposed a reaction to a stimulus, on the part of females.

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